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Call me an idiot, but I'm going to pick up a Surface 2

7K views 32 replies 9 participants last post by  j0dest3r 
#1 ·
The new Microsoft store in Edmonton is opening up on Saturday and I'm going to pick up a Surface 2. Yes I know it runs RT so no legacy apps, only Modern Apps. I'm going to use it as primarily a consumption device anyway. I had a Dell Venue Pro on order, but cancelled it today it stunk too much like a Netbook. (running an atom processor) I expect this device to be really fast and not have to worry about updating it more than a coupe of times a year. This article really made me re-think the whole thing and be ok with it. It's going to make a very nice companion device with my Windows 8.1 laptop with dual monitors.

Anyone else considering an RT device despite the bad rap or am I alone in this?
 
#3 ·
I would shell out the extra cash to get a Pro model that runs the full version of Win8. That's where the real advantage of the Surface tablets resides. A tablet running RT might be a nice piece of hardware with a nice O/S but it needs apps to be really useful. I've purchased computers with no third party software. They soon lose their appeal.
 
#4 ·
I don't want the Pro, I have enough Windows boxes most running 8 already. The app store has plenty of apps for the type of use I want this device for. I am purposely trading off the "advantage" as you call it for the simplicity, security, battery life, and weight. I don't perceive needing that advantage for this particular device as I have others to fill that need.
 
#6 ·
i would not buy the surface 2 because of the new bay trail tablets alone...

Asus T100 10" $349 - Full windows 8.1 tablet (anandtech tested 8.5 hours wifi surfing battery life too)
Dell Venue pro 8" 299 - - Full windows 8.1 tablet
Dell Venue Pro 11" 499 - - Full windows 8.1 tablet

the list goes on. Why get trapped in the world of RT when you can get FULL WINDOWS for the same price or less!!
 
#8 ·
As I said, those "Bay Trails" are still Atom processors. (lipstick on a pig comes to mind) Do you recall how Windows XP ran on those last gen? It's not going to be a whole lot different this time around. 32-bit slow processors constrained with 2GB of RAM! Imagine all those rich desktop apps that you currently run on your 64-Bit i5/i7 w/ 8 or 12GB of RAM running on an Atom w/ 2GB of RAM. Yech! no thanks! There is a reason net books are dead. This is basically net books 2.0!! I'd rather go RT and not tempt myself to load big heavy desktop apps that shouldn't be on a tablet in the first place. Let my laptop do the heavy loads. I just see these bay trail machines leaving the Windows sucks mantra in everyone's head that has to use these slow unresponsive machines AGAIN!! Net books 2.0!

Don't get me wrong, I was thinking the exact same way as you guys. As a matter of fact, I had a Dell Venue Pro on order, but cancelled it yesterday. It just doesn't make sense and that article I linked to in the opening post really hit it home for me.
 
#10 ·
Surprised nobody mentioned this yet.

J0dest3r you are an idiot!

No not really but you did ask and I felt compelled to help out a fellow DHCer. :)

But seriously you make a good point about heavy lifting. I moved away from my desktop to a netbook and then to a tablet. If 99% of what I want can be done on a lean OS and hardware then sign me up. It is like using Word to type emails (Remember that?) or Photoshop to view pictures. Seriously I know people who think they need Photoshop. Way too much bloat for what you need.
 
#11 ·
Have you not seen the reviews for the Asus t100? It crushes the competition for its price. These new atoms are not like there older siblings.

Your reasoning just doesnt make sense...

Saying you would be tempted to use something you know its not meant for is kinda silly...wouldnt you rather have the option if you needed to as a last resort? even if it didnt run well. Complaining it only has 2 GB or ram? the top of the line ios/android tablets only have 2gb as well...

Reasons why i will be getting a full windows vs RT is following

1) I can run TF2 or diablo 3 or civilization 5 from the steam store albit at low resolution
(so you dont have to purchase it twice or play a limited arm based version of the game) for some good gaming . Plus i can play every major "tablet" game via chrome browser

2) i can run google sketch up (i have had no luck finding an android substitute)

3) i can use it to install custom roms on my phone via adb/fastboot (no tablet os can do this...)

4) can run a proper version of XBMC (vs the beta/alpha for android)

5) i can set up an easy software based ip changer so i can watch US/BBC stuff(so even if im away at a friends house i dont need the router to be set up for it) - not sure if theres somethign like this for android/ RT

6) much more likely to support new video / audio codecs as they come out. For example bay trail can already play 4k videos.

theres more but im tired of typein...

I dont think Windows RT is bad i just think its too limited with these new products coming to the market. RT is gonna get squeezed out of the market and eventually just be part of there phone OS instead of a stand alone in between.
 
#12 ·
Jake said:
I moved away from my desktop to a netbook and then to a tablet. If 99% of what I want can be done on a lean OS and hardware then sign me up. It is like using Word to type emails (Remember that?) or Photoshop to view pictures.
On the flip side, I've tried to use touch-only devices for typing emails, and if you're doing anything more than a couple sentences it's pretty rough.

Something that is very simple on a PC like changing the order of two sentences (select the text, grab it and move it) takes 20x as long when you're doing it on iOS or Android. And that's not even counting issues like the autocorrect errors that are sometimes thrown your way.
 
#13 ·
Jake LOL! thx for that! ;) At least someone can see where I'm coming from

Redzone...

Saying you would be tempted to use something you know its not meant for is kinda silly...wouldnt you rather have the option if you needed to as a last resort? even if it didnt run well.
Nope I would rather it not have the option as a last resort, because the experience will be sub par. I also have other machines I can use instead for full desktop applications.

Complaining it only has 2 GB or ram? the top of the line ios/android tablets only have 2gb as well...
Right, but the top of the line competitor tablets are not trying to run OSX or Linux/GNU/X11 on them either! To me this is exactly what bay trail tablets are doing.

Reasons why i will be getting a full windows vs RT is following
I have only one item on my list that I am giving up by going RT over full blown 8.1

1. Bluestacks. I would love to be able to run virtualized Android apps on my Windows tablet. This one reason in my opinion is not enough to go bay trail.

3. Don't you have a laptop or desktop to do this from instead? Why does your tablet need to do this?

4. I plan to use Plex instead and there is already a modern app for it available.

5. I assume IP address changes can be made on a Surface RT. At home I handle this with a DHCP superscope which works with dumb devices like the Roku.

6. I plan to use VLC which there is already a modern app in development.

RT is gonna get squeezed out of the market and eventually just be part of there phone OS instead of a stand alone in between.
Agreed! Long term it's all going to be one. I see what is going on now as short - medium term pain for long term gain for Microsoft and will one day be a huge advantage over the competition. iOS and OSX will merge as one at some point as well, but Microsoft will be ahead of the game because they have already started the process.
 
#14 ·
Ah you hit the nail on the head. If I have a full windows tablet why do you need a laptop?

I currently don't have one so why would I buy a tablet and a laptop when these new bay trail or haswell units are two in one's!

I think this is huge as people don't want to switch between devices/don't have funds for two.
 
#15 ·
Haswell tab such as Surface 2 Pro, Agreed it is a two-in-one for sure! It's the same class of PC as a regular laptop. Bay Trail Atom, I am still not convinced.

I find it funny/interesting (and not directing this at you specifically, I'm speaking more as a general observation) that when it comes to owning two devices that are similar such as laptop and a Windows based tablet, there isn't enough funds. Yet there always seems to be enough funds to pick up a new iPad to go along with the PC.
 
#16 ·
I run Win7 and Win8 on an Atom processor. They run just fine. They are not as fast as they are of a desktop processor but perfectly usable. I would be a little about the 2GB of RAM. I have 4GB. That should be OK as long as no large Windows applications are used and the number of running applications is kept to a minimum.
 
#18 ·
I run Win7 and Win8 on an Atom processor.
I would be a little about the 2GB of RAM. I have 4GB.
If I remember correctly Atom can only use a maximum of 2GB of RAM unless things have changed this gen.


last gen atoms were so close im pretty convinced these new ones are gonna win me over.
That Bay Trail Atom ACER that you linked to previously had an overall positive review other than it wasn't able to run WOW. Not that running WOW should be a make it or break it.
 
#23 ·
I've had the Surface 2 since its release and I am very pleased with it. It's a keeper.
Biggest advantage - as familiar as a Windows 8.1 machine, but without the web-transmitted viruses and adware. For everything else - there's a Remote Desktop app.
The stand makes it surprisingly useful, much more than I actually expected. The iPad with the $55 Apple case is super flimsy in comparison. Netflix doesn't get any better on a portable device. You can also hold it in hand much easier if the stand is open.

The other pleasant surprise - the 16:9 1080p screen makes it perfect for reading books in 2 page view.
200GB SkyDrive for 2 years don't hurt either.
Lower number of incompatible web pages than with the iPad.
The apps I've tried so far look nothing like the phone apps. It's a plus.

Cons:
Battery life is a bit of a challenge. It feels that charging time comes much faster than with the iPad. But maybe that's because at this stage I am playing a lot with the desktop and Office.
Still haven't found any use for the portrait mode.
Many point out that the desktop is useless, but since I normally use it only to run File Explorer, I don't miss almost anything from the full-blown Windows. It calls for the Type Cover, though. I tried it and with it it's simply a very elegant ultrabook with it.
 
#24 ·
Congrats on your purchase. Nice to hear someone else "gets" it! ;-)

I went to the store opening at WEM and got a free 1st gen touch cover out of the deal. I am going to stick with that for now. The only time I really type on it is when I'm using the remote desktop client. It's not like a real keyboard that's for sure. The next thing I'm going to try is hooking it up to the TV via the mini HDMI port and hooking up the wireless Xbox controller. I have found the games Halo: Spartan Assault, Six-Guns, Reckless Racing Ultimate, Street Outlaws, Crash Course Go, Soul Craft, and Endless Skater all can use the controller. It's like a mini portable Xbox. ;) Time for some play instead of work! ;)

Oh, I also found a jailbreak for it but am not really interested in using it at this time. There are a few desktop apps popping up such as 7zip and Putty that have been re-compiled for ARM.
 
#25 ·
A bit of a shocker to me, Surface doesn't support Silverlight which I guess would be fine except it DOES support Flash! So idiotic! Either support both or none not the other guys and yours not. I went to watch a webinar today and couldn't do it because no Silverlight support.

I found a pretty interesting workaround. TS Remote App. I knew you could do this with a Remote Desktop Session Host server, but not just with a client OS. I found this utility that simply builds out remote apps via the registry and creates a TS rdp file with all the settings. It was so easy I couldn't believe it. Now that the remote desktop client is available on other platforms such as MAC iOS and Android, I wonder if one could remote app with those devices as well.
Here is the link
It even supports remote apps on a webpage.
 
#26 ·
I find it amusing using the term "jail break" in conjunction with Windows.

Personally, the biggest "problem" with using my Surface Pro as a tablet is that the display is a 16:9 ratio, which never seems to be ideal. I'd much prefer a 4:3 ratio. I understand that they depend on a wide display for multitasking, but when I just want to fire up Zinio and read a magazine, or browse the web, the display aspect ratio seems to be sub-par.

This is also a issue with my Nexus 7.
 
#28 ·
So i had a chance to play with the asus t100 man if the screen wasnt so dark i would of bought it on the spot!

This new atom is incedible compared to last get. i ran half screen desktop mode with ie open (4-5 tabs to start) then half screen ie app. in teh ie app i ran a 1080p youtub video .

in the desktop ie i ran another 1080p youtube video and then switched to the other 4 open tabs. clicking on links and getting it to load different sites including engadget(one of the heaviest sites out there)

not a glitch! ran amazing. this has completely left me astonished how far mobile computing has come. if all you want to do is surf and watch video any laptop made in 2014 should do it (assuming its intel)

as for the asus t100 intelf the screen is wildly dark. when i look at reviews its actuality half the brightness of competitors like ipad/ windows surface 2.

would be fine indoors but completly useless with ambient lights. In the staples i struggled to see the screen on full brightness.
 
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